Clan UFW

Warcraft 3 USEast Clan for Fate / Another
 
HomeCalendarFAQSearchMemberlistUsergroupsRegisterLog in

Share | 
 

 Anti-Camping Idead

View previous topic View next topic Go down 
AuthorMessage
yggdrasil

avatar

Rank : Dark Saber (11) Posts : 76
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 24
Location : YOUR HOUSE

PostSubject: Anti-Camping Idead   Mon Oct 01, 2012 10:11 am

I was playing f/a on taiwan gerena and i was like SHIT MAN this is a rage camp war and i mean rage rage camp! So i was thinking of a way to help make the attacker side.

Ta Combo Changes > When TA uses his combo, a message will appear(alerting the enemies) and 1 second later, it will activate. Idea taken from Book of Dead from index.

Ward hp changed to 90.
ZC Castle requires 10 mana to explode

On both side of bridge, within 1500 range of the bridge, several penalties will be implemented. Wards loses 3 hp per seconds(dies after 30 seconds). All castle suffer a -50 hp(can destroy castle) and mp degen. All heroes loses 4%(that is 40 if 1000 mana) of their max mana per second. All heroes loses 3% of their max hp per second(Does not kill).(Creatures loses bonus 2% for total of 5%). Reduce physical damage by 50%, armor by 10 and attack speed by 75%. Within 500 range of center of bridge is safe zone.

Balance boost: If a team is down more than 1 player, the enemy team will suffer -50% ms within 2500 range of center on bridge. (This prevent hit and camp) And the team's penalty near the bridge is negated until the team number balanced again.

Totally unrelated idea: Change hrunt to be ground target instead of unit. Units within 250 range of hrunt take 100% damage and half that outside. OR make it so that hrunt will hit the ground and explode even if dodged.
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://myanimelist.net/profile/Yggdrasil
Laruku



Rank : Archer(1) Posts : 589
Join date : 2009-08-01
Age : 24
Location : Ottawa, Ontario, Canada

PostSubject: Re: Anti-Camping Idead   Mon Oct 01, 2012 2:41 pm

No thats just cause garena sucks
Back to top Go down
View user profile
josph

avatar

Rank : Lancer (5) Posts : 292
Join date : 2010-03-19
Age : 22
Location : Canada,Quebec,Montreal

PostSubject: Re: Anti-Camping Idead   Wed Oct 03, 2012 11:44 pm

you can never really solve the problem of camping DM for fate. The only thing you can do is change the functions that allow and facilitate camping which is pretty much castles and wards.

Wards is hard thing to change because many heros benefit from wards or sight in general and one hero in particular is based off the ward.. which is ta. so nerfing wards technically means buffing ta in a sense and buffing them results in making camping easier. In all respects, you need some sort of middle and the middle that we so far got is like 100 seconds.

Castles or casters in general: since camping is so easy when you have a caster on your side, the only way to actually change the castle without making a huge change to the game is basically buffing/nerfing castles. lucky for us, we practically made castles half of casters skill power so nerfing castle is technically nerfing a big part of casters, again you need middle point.

so basically, if the 2 things that make camping so easy are variables that directly affect the game if changed; the question simply becomes, "what can we do to stop making the game so boring and flat on camping?".

2 things that i could think of for fixing camping:
1) remove them, the problem with that is removing wards means removing ta which for many is not an option as what if ta was your favorite hero(poor charismapeon on this one)? the same goes for castles, castles are part of casters so it's like denying content in the game. most people seek to expand and add elements to the game; not removing them so basically this idea just can't work even though it would solve the problem to some degree.
2) changing roles of caster: This is probably way i could ever think of to solve camping. Basically we invented 2 hero that allow "easy" camping, something that was probably intended at the early stages of development in the game but isn't so interesting anymore. well if you can create 2 hero's that can create camp; you can surely do the opposite. The castle is like an sign in the game that basically says "DANGER DO NOT STAND IN THIS AREA". the reason for that is obvious, your entering a spot where you are clearly at a disadvantage against both sight and damage factors(castle explode).

The casters themselves are opposite to each other or at least (the original idea was to be opposite). This is mainly expressed in their castles, one that deals damage overtime, grants an hp aura and lifesteal vs one that gives mana aura, has mana steal and does instant damage. The other main opposite is selfish and sacrifice of course but this is irrelevant. The interesting part of castles in the game is that they don't at all reflect how both casters used them in the story. we basically use the castles mostly for one purpose which is castle explode to deal damage and of course the sight it gives. in the story, caster uses it to drain mana from the town and zc uses it to slaughter people(life force..). The only way to make someone rush is basically to give an advantage to doing so or disadvantage for not doing so. So the logic behind it all is; why not make casters provide a disadvantage to the enemy team for not rushing over an advantage for the team for having the castle.

Suggestion: Give castles one time per round build which only provides an aura that is irreversible and which in short will make the castle a living ticking time bomb.

Caster castle: provides -5 mana reg aura global to the entire map that is non-replenishable(you can't put mana stats to counter this effect but potions work) until destroyed. when the round is over and if castle is still alive(full mana), deals 2000 damage that is halved if b scroll is on.

Zero caster castle: provides -3 dereg hp aura global to the entire map that is non-replenishable until destroyed. when the timer of a around is over, the castle(full mana) will deal 2000 damage global that is halved if a scroll is on.

Main Result: Casters become center point of dm which in some sense many would argue that they already are in a unappealing form or way.

other side results: gold consumption increases
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Milky Holmes

avatar

Rank : Avenger (12) Posts : 245
Join date : 2011-02-08

PostSubject: Re: Anti-Camping Idead   Thu Oct 04, 2012 9:04 am

Or you could get rid of the bridge and river and just make that one part of the level all connected.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Elizabet2

avatar

Posts : 39
Join date : 2011-12-12

PostSubject: Re: Anti-Camping Idead   Fri Oct 05, 2012 5:07 pm

Milky Holmes wrote:
Or you could get rid of the bridge and river and just make that one part of the level all connected.

And destroy all fun? Naaa
Back to top Go down
View user profile
yggdrasil

avatar

Rank : Dark Saber (11) Posts : 76
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 24
Location : YOUR HOUSE

PostSubject: Re: Anti-Camping Idead   Sat Oct 06, 2012 10:46 am

josph wrote:
you can never really solve the problem of camping DM for fate. The only thing you can do is change the functions that allow and facilitate camping which is pretty much castles and wards.

Wards is hard thing to change because many heros benefit from wards or sight in general and one hero in particular is based off the ward.. which is ta. so nerfing wards technically means buffing ta in a sense and buffing them results in making camping easier. In all respects, you need some sort of middle and the middle that we so far got is like 100 seconds.

Castles or casters in general: since camping is so easy when you have a caster on your side, the only way to actually change the castle without making a huge change to the game is basically buffing/nerfing castles. lucky for us, we practically made castles half of casters skill power so nerfing castle is technically nerfing a big part of casters, again you need middle point.

so basically, if the 2 things that make camping so easy are variables that directly affect the game if changed; the question simply becomes, "what can we do to stop making the game so boring and flat on camping?".

2 things that i could think of for fixing camping:
1) remove them, the problem with that is removing wards means removing ta which for many is not an option as what if ta was your favorite hero(poor charismapeon on this one)? the same goes for castles, castles are part of casters so it's like denying content in the game. most people seek to expand and add elements to the game; not removing them so basically this idea just can't work even though it would solve the problem to some degree.
2) changing roles of caster: This is probably way i could ever think of to solve camping. Basically we invented 2 hero that allow "easy" camping, something that was probably intended at the early stages of development in the game but isn't so interesting anymore. well if you can create 2 hero's that can create camp; you can surely do the opposite. The castle is like an sign in the game that basically says "DANGER DO NOT STAND IN THIS AREA". the reason for that is obvious, your entering a spot where you are clearly at a disadvantage against both sight and damage factors(castle explode).

The casters themselves are opposite to each other or at least (the original idea was to be opposite). This is mainly expressed in their castles, one that deals damage overtime, grants an hp aura and lifesteal vs one that gives mana aura, has mana steal and does instant damage. The other main opposite is selfish and sacrifice of course but this is irrelevant. The interesting part of castles in the game is that they don't at all reflect how both casters used them in the story. we basically use the castles mostly for one purpose which is castle explode to deal damage and of course the sight it gives. in the story, caster uses it to drain mana from the town and zc uses it to slaughter people(life force..). The only way to make someone rush is basically to give an advantage to doing so or disadvantage for not doing so. So the logic behind it all is; why not make casters provide a disadvantage to the enemy team for not rushing over an advantage for the team for having the castle.

Suggestion: Give castles one time per round build which only provides an aura that is irreversible and which in short will make the castle a living ticking time bomb.

Caster castle: provides -5 mana reg aura global to the entire map that is non-replenishable(you can't put mana stats to counter this effect but potions work) until destroyed. when the round is over and if castle is still alive(full mana), deals 2000 damage that is halved if b scroll is on.

Zero caster castle: provides -3 dereg hp aura global to the entire map that is non-replenishable until destroyed. when the timer of a around is over, the castle(full mana) will deal 2000 damage global that is halved if a scroll is on.

Main Result: Casters become center point of dm which in some sense many would argue that they already are in a unappealing form or way.

other side results: gold consumption increases

Josph, do you like typing lot of paragraphs? Cuz i don't like reading it(thats is why i don't read it any more). I mean if you got point to make, please just get to it, cuz all i see is you going in circle.

Also i am gonna second laruku's most of player in taiwan sux, i just won 6 rounds for my team as saber with 0.5 delays and i got like the best score -.- FOR THE LOVE OF GOD I PLAY ZL MAN! There is something with taiwan ppl wanting to run away by them self(chinese selfish nature?). They got even worst teamwork then east and no one can even take initiative, they just like camping. i have to lead like all of our charge and rush(WAIT? I RUSH? SHIT JUST HAPPENED).
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://myanimelist.net/profile/Yggdrasil
josph

avatar

Rank : Lancer (5) Posts : 292
Join date : 2010-03-19
Age : 22
Location : Canada,Quebec,Montreal

PostSubject: Re: Anti-Camping Idead   Sun Oct 07, 2012 11:06 am

If you want a summary, It's basically that wards/castles allow camping but they can't be removed from the game without changing it, removing bridge/river is included to that. The only thing people accept as change is basically hero changes. Guss what? the only hero aspect is castles or casters if you want to be more broad. There's my suggestion in a nut shell.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
yggdrasil

avatar

Rank : Dark Saber (11) Posts : 76
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 24
Location : YOUR HOUSE

PostSubject: Re: Anti-Camping Idead   Sun Oct 07, 2012 2:31 pm

That is why i put a massive degen on castle and ward near bridge for that purpose -.-
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://myanimelist.net/profile/Yggdrasil
EternalDevote
Fate/Another Official Tester
avatar

Posts : 1162
Join date : 2010-04-04
Age : 25
Location : New Canada that's in the sky above old Canada

PostSubject: Re: Anti-Camping Idead   Wed Oct 10, 2012 1:06 am

Some of these ideas just make it even worse to actually want to assault the other side and enforce the camping even more >_>

Why rush across the bridge when you can camp and the enemy will spend around 10 seconds just going through the bridge degen zone losing most of their mana and health. Then when you see them actually about to exit the degen zone you can camp near where they're going and you'll have a clear advantage which just makes assaulting massively worse than actually camping.

Your ideas may have been to stop camping but also remember that the areas you're trying to reduce 'camping' are also the areas that support assaulting as well. These ideas don't necessarily reduce camping, just make it harder to actually rush across the bridge without losing most of your mana and health.

1500 area near the bridge is still an easy place to defend and camp. That and giving territories both mana and health degen is just doing the same thing twice and pretty much an oxymoron in itself because it nearly makes it impossible to actually explode a territory near the bridge if the degen of mana is too high. Which in itself is pointless if you're making them already have health degen. (Which honestly just hurts Caster's territory more than ZC's because his needs little mana to do good damage and can heal itself. That and ZC's can just teleport onto the bridge and only suffers about 1.5 seconds of degen while Casters will spend nearly 3+ seconds.)

tl;dr These ideas don't reduce camping, just make assaulting massively worse and move the area that is actually camped.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
yggdrasil

avatar

Rank : Dark Saber (11) Posts : 76
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 24
Location : YOUR HOUSE

PostSubject: Re: Anti-Camping Idead   Wed Oct 10, 2012 8:22 pm

Hence within the center of the bridge, the effect is negated making is easier to cross the bridge.

It was my oversight to not consider castle tp, that part need to be modify to target teleportation such as disabling the castle 1 sec after teleportation within the zone.
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://myanimelist.net/profile/Yggdrasil
simodino

avatar

Posts : 303
Join date : 2010-03-01

PostSubject: Re: Anti-Camping Idead   Wed Oct 10, 2012 11:54 pm

Too complicated.Imo just add some place where you can teleport around the map;for example go to the dock and for some gold you go near emiya house or go the ilya castle and you can teleport to church graveyard.(Only one way teleport)
Back to top Go down
View user profile
EternalDevote
Fate/Another Official Tester
avatar

Posts : 1162
Join date : 2010-04-04
Age : 25
Location : New Canada that's in the sky above old Canada

PostSubject: Re: Anti-Camping Idead   Thu Oct 11, 2012 6:56 am

yggdrasil wrote:
Hence within the center of the bridge, the effect is negated making is easier to cross the bridge.

It was my oversight to not consider castle tp, that part need to be modify to target teleportation such as disabling the castle 1 sec after teleportation within the zone.

Even with this 'safe' zone you'll either have to stand there to heal the 6-15% they've lost getting to the center, then after that they'll have to cross another 'degen zone' to fully assault the other side where they'd end up losing 6-15% again along with if any of them happen to get caught inside nine or another stun, they're pretty much instantly dead.

Bridge does need work but making it have degen properties doesn't only hurt the camping side, it hurts the rushing side more since you can just camp the end of the degen zone and your enemies are now weaker than you. Also sometimes a team doesn't even need to camp the bridge to camp so this doesn't really solve the camping issue, just removes a location available to camp.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
yggdrasil

avatar

Rank : Dark Saber (11) Posts : 76
Join date : 2009-09-21
Age : 24
Location : YOUR HOUSE

PostSubject: Re: Anti-Camping Idead   Thu Oct 11, 2012 3:08 pm

EternalDevote wrote:
yggdrasil wrote:
Hence within the center of the bridge, the effect is negated making is easier to cross the bridge.

It was my oversight to not consider castle tp, that part need to be modify to target teleportation such as disabling the castle 1 sec after teleportation within the zone.

Even with this 'safe' zone you'll either have to stand there to heal the 6-15% they've lost getting to the center, then after that they'll have to cross another 'degen zone' to fully assault the other side where they'd end up losing 6-15% again along with if any of them happen to get caught inside nine or another stun, they're pretty much instantly dead.

Bridge does need work but making it have degen properties doesn't only hurt the camping side, it hurts the rushing side more since you can just camp the end of the degen zone and your enemies are now weaker than you. Also sometimes a team doesn't even need to camp the bridge to camp so this doesn't really solve the camping issue, just removes a location available to camp.

Oh shit, that was totally my bad, i didn't mention an important fact: The penalty only affect heroes/units/building on the side they spawn on, if they are in enemy territories, the degen do not affect them
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://myanimelist.net/profile/Yggdrasil
frankiethefly



Rank : Gilgamesh(2) Posts : 528
Join date : 2009-08-05

PostSubject: Re: Anti-Camping Idead   Thu Nov 15, 2012 2:31 pm

Yo guys long time no see,

How about this:

Just fuck it all up and add the teleport from arena gameplay. I know it will nerf certain characters. Think outside of the box before picking this idea apart, please.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Sponsored content




PostSubject: Re: Anti-Camping Idead   

Back to top Go down
 
Anti-Camping Idead
View previous topic View next topic Back to top 
Page 1 of 1
 Similar topics
-
» Need a good strag for anti tau *updated list*
» Anti LAG guide
» CC Dreadnought as Anti Tank?
» Dark Eldar and Anti Air?
» Fake anti-aim (between thirdperson & firstperson)

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
Clan UFW :: Fate / Another III :: Suggestions / Bug Reports-
Jump to: